Power to the People: Should Your Kid Be Taught English Only?
Fox News
PAULA ZAHN, HOST: Welcome back. Tonight, we have a new EDGE feature for you. We're calling it Power to the People. Every year during the election season, there are issues that are too hot or simply too controversial for one person or political group to handle, so they are given to the people to vote so they can decide. Well, every Monday night, FOX NEWS Channel's Douglas Kennedy will examine one of those issues. And tonight he will take a look at bilingual education. Should your kid be taught English only? (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) DOUGLAS KENNEDY, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Thirteen-year- old Carla Corral spent a year in Arizona's bilingual education program. She emerged dazed and confused, unable to speak English with her mom. CARLA CORRAL, 13-YEAR-OLD ARIZONA STUDENT: She'd want me to do it in English, but I wouldn't know how to do it in English, because they only told me in Spanish. KENNEDY: Carla's mother is a Mexican immigrant who wanted Carla to learn English, something she couldn't do in the Spanish-only classes. They are now part of a group trying to ban bilingual education in Arizona, a ballot initiative funded by controversial California millionaire Ron Unz. JOE EDDIE LOPEZ, ARIZONA STATE SENATOR: The reasons that they are proposing this initiative has to do with things other than their students being able to learn. KENNEDY (on camera): Well, what are those things? LOPEZ: We have some xenophobes in this state and throughout this country that believe that English is the only language that is necessary. KENNEDY: There are some who say that you are simply trying to get rid of a culture, that when you talk about English, you're getting rid of Spanish, you're getting rid of the Hispanic culture. UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: That's not true. This is English for the children. It means we want our children in the public schools to be taught English. That's what we're saying. KENNEDY (voice-over): It wasn't supposed to be this way. UNIDENTIFIED MALE STUDENT: (speaks in Spanish) KENNEDY: Teaching Hispanic children in Spanish was meant to help them learn English faster. (on camera): There are currently 93,000 students in Arizona's bilingual education program. A recent Department of Education study here indicates that only 2.8 percent flourish in English. They say this bilingual education program is not working. What's your response? LOPEZ: Well, they're wrong, and they know that they are wrong. The - - all the studies that have been done now, and there are several longitudinal studies, clearly indicate that when these programs are properly implemented, bilingual education works. NORMA ALVAREZ, BILINGUAL EDUCATION OPPONENT: If it was working, how come our scores are so low? We've asked, you know, for proof that it's working. We're not against something that's working. Obviously it's not, because our kids are not making it. KENNEDY (voice-over): Two years ago, Unz funded and passed a similar proposal in California. By most accounts, it's been a success, with Hispanic students learning English faster. Still, some worry about the repercussions on Arizona's Hispanic community. LOPEZ: It can be very divisive, and for that reason we don't think that we ought to be considering an initiative of this nature. KENNEDY (on camera): A recent poll showed 70 percent of Arizona in favor of banning bilingual education. In November, the state will vote, (voice-over): In Phoenix, Arizona, Douglas Kennedy, FOX NEWS. ZAHN: So where do you stand on the issue? To help you decide, we have both sides of the debate. From San Francisco, the chairman of English for the Children and sponsor of Proposition 227 in California, Ron Unz. And from our D.C. bureau, Brent Wilkes, the national executive director of the League of United Latin American Citizens. Good to see the two of you. RON UNZ, ENGLISH FOR THE CHILDREN: Good evening. BRENT WILKES, LEAGUE OF UNITED LATIN AMERICAN CITIZENS: Great to be here. ZAHN: Mr. Wilkes -- You're very welcome. Mr. Wilkes, what is your strongest argument in favor of bilingual education? WILKES: I think the strongest argument is that it's an excellent educational structure and technique that has proven to be very, very successful in certain circumstances. And we think it should be preserved, and the students should be allowed to have the choice, along with their parents, of how they want to be taught English. ZAHN: Mr. Unz? UNZ: If it worked I would support it, but it's a miserable failure. In California, 95 percent of the children failed to learn English every year. Under the new system of 227, students are doing much better, and you can see it in the headlines. I think the state's largest... WILKES: (inaudible) the results are... UNZ: ... largest newspapers have clearly indicated it works ZAHN: Mr. Wilkes... WILKES: The results are (inaudible)... ZAHN: ... what do you say about those... WILKES: ... (inaudible)... ZAHN: ... results? And on the heels of the results, Doug had in his piece showing that basically 2 percent of those kids in that Arizona program were speaking English after being in the bilingual ed program. WILKES: Well, that's fluent English. And I think that what you have to look at is that there's much stronger development overall, they said 5 percent per year is the average, of people learning English. And, you know, we're talking about inner city children, children that are at the lower socioeconomic scale, and so there are other factors that impede their educational progress besides just the bilingual education programs. I think they're very good programs, and they should be an option that educators and parents and teachers can use. ZAHN: All right, gentlemen, if you would, hold your thoughts, because we're going to debate it on the other side of the break. And a little bit later on, regardless of the language, this man is known to just about everyone around the world. Jim Nabors is back, and he'll join us straight ahead. Keep it right here on THE EDGE. (COMMERCIAL BREAK) (AUDIO GAP) ZAHN: ... EDGE face-off on bilingual education with Brent Wilkes and Ron Unz. Welcome back. Mr. Unz, one of the points that Douglas Kennedy's guest brought up in his piece that he claims that your effort is not just about learning but basically you have some xenophobes, as he called you all, in California who are trying to wipe out other cultures other than American culture. UNZ: I think that's very silly. The vast majority of immigrant parents want their children taught English in schools. What we're talking about is not English-only, it's not official English. We're saying, whether young immigrant children should or should not be taught English in the public schools. I think they should be taught English, and their parents agree. Also, (inaudible)... WILKES: (inaudible), of a 15,000 parents in Arizona which were in the bilingual education program, only a handful, about 50, opted out of that program when given the choice. So... UNZ: They're not given... WILKES: ... I don't see how -- they are given the choice, and they opted not to leave the program. And this bill would force them not to. And it is a strange bill. It's not coming from Arizona, it's coming from California. Ron Unz is the only financial backer of this bill in Arizona, and I think that's a very telling fact. It's not an Arizona bill. UNZ: Let me explain something. The people in Arizona are the ones who started this effort, and I'm helping them along. They also have been talking to the press and bringing to the press's attention immigrant parents in Arizona who sometimes spent years trying to get their children out of bilingual programs and have their children talk English instead. And the schools refused. It's exactly the same as California. Furthermore... WILKES: If this is simply... UNZ: ... with regard -- Excuse me. Furthermore, with regard... ZAHN: Mr. Unz, hang on one second. Let Mr. Wilkes respond to that. WILKES: Yes, if this is simply a matter of choice, we'll support a bill that -- if Unz wants to make it an optional program for parents to choose into or choose out, we'll support that. That's what we're pushing for, parental choice. He's -- his bill will force people into a specific methodology which is unproven and against the wishes of the parents that are currently in this program. So why would you force that on people? UNZ: (inaudible)... ZAHN: So would you buy into that idea of an optional program, Mr. Unz, or not? UNZ: That's the thing. Our initiative is -- does provide the option. because it allows... WILKES: No, it does -- no, it has not. UNZ: Excuse me. Excuse me. It allows parents who wish to place their children or keep their children in a bilingual program to apply for a waiver to do so if there's any evidence that the program benefits the child's education. It allows... WILKES: The waiver... UNZ: ... choice. WILKES: The waiver provisions in this bill are even worse than the one that was in California. It's very difficult to receive a waiver. Right now, parents have the option to opt out of bilingual education if they want to, and that's the parental choice program that's in place at the moment. There's no need for Unz to come into Arizona and try to push his divisive bill on the people of Arizona. ZAHN: Let me move on to another issue, and I want both of you to weigh on on this. Is there any proof that Hispanic students learn English any quicker in English-only classrooms? Mr. Wilkes? WILKES: No, there is not any proof. In fact, there are plenty of studies which show that the best English acquisition is a bilingual education program that lasts for many years, because they learn English at a truer rate by using their native language to understand what they're talking about. It's just common sense that you'll be able to pick up English faster if you force them into an immersion program. Now, immersion does help with a little quick pickup in terms of casual English, but it's not going to last for long career in school, and that's what we're really focusing on, is how to best teach students in English for the long haul. ZAHN: Mr. Unz, I see you shaking your head no, no, no. UNZ: the facts are so different than that. First of all, the research he's talking about is funded by the bilingual education industry. The people make their living from this program. WILKES: Well, this... UNZ: Second of all -- excuse me... WILKES: The guy with the money is you, Mr. Unz. UNZ: ... excuse me... WILKES: You're the one that's buying all these studies. UNZ: Excuse me, excuse me. In California, we've seen the results of a million children who are not being taught English now being taught English. And "The San Jose Mercury News," one of the state's largest statistical analysis of the results, and found that after seven months of the new curriculum, immigrant students who stayed in schools that used bilingual education scored much lower than students who moved into 227 classes. The differences were 20 percent, 40 percent, even 100 percent improvement in test scores after less than one year. ZAHN: Mr. Unz... UNZ: The Arizona program has a 97 percent failure rate in teaching English, and that's a failure. ZAHN: One last question for you, Mr. Unz, because I saw Mr. Wilkes shaking his head about this one. You brought up the compromise bilingual education money being pumped into this program. How is your money any different that's going from California into the Arizona program? UNZ: Oh, I'm not saying there's anything -- I oppose bilingual education. I think children should be taught English in schools. We're giving the children -- we're giving the parents in Arizona and we're giving the voters a chance to decide whether or not immigrant children should be taught English. ZAHN: Mr. Wilkes, you... UNZ: I'm just saying the studies are biased. ZAHN: ... get the last word. WILKES: They're politicizing an educational issue. Educators, parents, teachers, those are the folks who should be making the decision, not Ron Unz from California trying to force his will on the people of Arizona. They need to reject this divisive proposition and tell him to go back to California. ZAHN: Well, gentlemen, we're going to have to leave it there. And clearly, a lot of voters in different parts of the country are going to have to make those same judgments. We appreciate your educating us to both sides of the debate tonight here on THE EDGE. |